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Post by AKNOVA on Feb 24, 2010 6:58:42 GMT -9
SPRSTK
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well, I'm a delay box guy! Haven't been all my career, but I am now. It doesn't make you a better or great racer. It's just the type of racing that I enjoy to do. I would rather win or lose by .002 than .120! That close and tight racing turns me on and is what I truly enjoy to do! When I first started doing this thing we call drag racing (a long time ago) I was a clutch and 4-speed guy. I thought that if you had an automatic you had an unfair advantage. And yes, they had an advantage -- not a unfair advantage -- but an advantage. But that's the way they wanted to race, and I was racing the way that I wanted to race, letting the clutch fly and banging the gears. I finally went to the automatic car because I wanted to be more competitive. Who likes to lose the first round at every race? I don't think any of us do. I started with an electric shifter at first, then found out that the solenoid will start to overheat after time and let you down. I converted to an air shifter and now I love every aspect of it and have no problems..well you do have to remember to turn the air bottle on. The Dedenbear air shifter is a great product. I have run both types of Dedenbear delay boxes -- thumb wheel and push button. The thumb wheel type would be a great box for an entry-level person, just to get to learn the delay feeling. I have a Biondo Mega 450 in the Chevelle, and like it a lot. It has a large screen for the old guy to see better but they run about $500.00 You can shift the car @ rpm or on a timer. The Biondo Mega 450 has a reaction tester built into it as well; however, you still have to let go of the button! The car and delay box can't read the tree! And when you race in a box class, there aren't any sandbaggers to deal with! Also, when you have a lot of electronics in your race car or truck , remember to charge your batteries once in awhile.
And Clint, you know how to beat the delay box boys and girls, as you do have TWO Ironmen!!!!
So, I think it's up to the individual racer on how they want to race and what class they want to race in. But, Top Dragster is a tough class, and I wouldn't go into it without a delay box. I'm not a masochist!
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Post by AKNOVA on Feb 24, 2010 6:59:27 GMT -9
Candyman
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Clint, that looks like the same K&R board that I am using in my car, if your lookng for a box a I would take a hard look at the K&R delay box as well. Directly compatable with your board and would wire up exactly as the very nice laminated wiring diagram depicts. Having read Mike's reasoning for being box equipped, and recognizing that money bracket and iron man competitions do not segragate box / no box, and the ability to tune the box to match the leave on the first light install of the box makes good sense. Mike is dead on with his comment about that electric solinoid building heat...it will stay energized when the car maintains RPM past the chip set point. Mine gets plenty warm for sure.
Here's me thinking between Mike and yourself, you would have the box routine down pat in short order. d**n, there goes another car that lays down routine .02 / 0.03 packages! That would be good fun at the stripe with two cars waiting for the computer to declare the winner!
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Post by AKNOVA on Feb 24, 2010 7:00:10 GMT -9
SPRSTK
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In 2009 I did talk the track manager into running all of the no-box people against each other and the same for the box people, and then the winners of each category then run off in the final. By then each finalist should be pretty dialed-in on the tree. That just makes the most sense. As for the money bracket? I think it should be run the same way. But I don't imagine it will ever come to that.
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Post by AKNOVA on Feb 24, 2010 7:00:48 GMT -9
Candyman
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yep, we just do not have the car count to sort them into more specific fields. It's all good, first round runner up gets the green light on the beer! I am thankful they keep them juniors out of the mix, getting spanked by a 10 year old kid would be hard to take!
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Post by AKNOVA on Feb 24, 2010 7:01:36 GMT -9
White Lightning
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ..... gotta keep those kids away from my coffee bean stash.....
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Post by Threadkiller on Mar 1, 2010 13:25:04 GMT -9
Good day, my take on the delay box thing To imply Nathan Thornsley wins because his car is “computer controlled” is incredibly ignorant. Consider the entire package of equipment he is running. From stem to stern, this is a precision bracket racing device. Most door slammers are generally at a disadvantage when paired up against a BBC powered Yancer pivoting mono shock dragster. Regardless of who is packing what ancillary hardware. You may consider the delay box a cheating device, but it is an accepted accessory on a national basis. One approach would be to master this device, work to become competitive in the multitude of classes available where it is legal. How many of you someday may want to take a crack at Top Sportsman or Top Dragster? And actually win rounds? You race on one of the great practice tracks in the nation.
To say that resulting reaction time is a sole product of the delay box is incorrect. The loose nut behind the wheel still has to let go of the button. The delay box will improve your consistency of reaction time because your reference point is more finite. A little less of an opportunity for your brain to get in the way, the box does not drive the car. Okay Mod racers, consider this; your ride runs accurate low nines, your head is on straight, you develop a consistent trend of going red by .02 / .04 by leaving on the last yellow; what do you do? The old bulb filament thing is gone due to the LED lights. Nothing? Time a waiting period in your brain? Do you decrease air pressure in the front tires? Run taller front tires? Increase the travel in the front end? Long throw trans brake switch? Blinders on the windshield? All mechanical delay or mental conditioning devices. The little box of electronics just makes this part of racecar tuning easier (hee hee). I agree with the format of separated classes, it needs to be that way. However, do we need to put ourselves on a pedestal because we think we are a Drag racing purest?
Clint; look at the Biondo Mega 450 like Superstocks’
Michael Ginnett IHRA 566 B
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Post by ProStreetNova on Mar 1, 2010 13:37:36 GMT -9
Still, if a driver can pin point his & his cars reation time, he can better program the box. Then after that, the box does the launching. Now if I could just get my brain to calculate .280 delay, I'd be something.
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Post by "Wild Child" on Mar 1, 2010 14:50:43 GMT -9
I dont think its ignorant to say that his car is computer "controlled", yes a doorcar does have a lot less likely chance of winning because it has a 100 more variables in a run then a dragster does. One thing Wild Willy said in an interview after being asked why he drove an altered, he stated, "If I wanted to go strait and have it be point and shoot, i would have a dragster" Even though at the time, dragsters were still in the works, the advantage was known. One of the oldest sayings in dragracing is "combining man and machine", not "Man, Machine and electronics". To be honest, it sounds like we just have a bunch of grassroute drag racers who, if they had the chance, would run off of hand drops every other weekend. Im not saying its cheating, but it does give drivers a certain edge that most people with an honest eye and regular reflexes can't match with. What would be really nice is if we had Mod e.t extend to a 11.99 to 7.50 class or so, so the people who wanted to go faster then 8.50 and still be competitive could run those times without having a delay box. I know thats the one big reason my mom wants to stay in mod is because she wants to be competitive, but doesnt want a delay box, and dads a mechanic, hes not part of geek squad. Sorry if this comes across as "Snude" or "Mean" to anyone.
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Post by AkRacer on Mar 1, 2010 15:40:51 GMT -9
Devin, A delay box has nothing to do with the top end, it's a starting thing. It's only used for improving on ones R/T. Sense most races are won or lost at the starting line. With most boxes the driver lets off the button on the flash of the first yellow and the computer counts down to a pre-set point and releases the trans brake. After factoring in their eye to hand reaction (Human Factor) and the cars reaction time, most box guys can cut perfect lights almost every time. All no-box racers wait till the last yellow and try to cut that elusive perfect light. That is the purest form of Drag Racing. Another way to look at it is like gun slingers. The quickest draw wins.
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Post by "Wild Child" on Mar 1, 2010 16:50:38 GMT -9
I dont know where you got that I was talking about the top end. I said i was aware that a dragster is more consistent because a door car has 100 more variables because he said.."Most door slammers are generally at a disadvantage when paired up against a BBC powered Yancer pivoting mono shock dragster". and even still, a door car has a ton more variables just at the starting line. How often do you see a dragster launch and go for the wall? And no offense, But I know. I know a lot about them. For 16, I know a lot about race cars, but not much else. I got to learn about delay boxes from Down Town willy Brown in his "crossover 101" to John Scantlin. Plus i got to remove the delay box from moms car when she bought it. Also, I got to see a delay boxes effectiveness at the banquet when i went against Nathan Thornsley and won 4 out of the 10, but mainly because he was still setting up his delay box. and yeah, I know. Off your own reaction, not your first reaction. And trust me on this one, i know that a reaction time can be the difference, thats the only reason I won any of my trophies against Ryan Rolloff. But back to the point, the delay boxes give a big advantage when you can tell it to give you this much human reaction to the light, you can literally tune it to where you are running .03 lights everytime. In nathan's case, .003 lights every time. Granted, yes, it must be a pain in the a$$ to tune in a delay box, but it seems like once you've got it down, its done. With a no-box racer, its a big gamble every time you see the third light come down and let off that button.
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Post by "Wild Child" on Mar 1, 2010 16:52:21 GMT -9
Maybe you got the top end thing from me saying that people wanted to be competitive and run 7.50 or so, but my point was, if you pass 8.50, your in top dragster, and without a delay box, you're chances of winning in that class are slim to none.
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Post by semi serious on Mar 1, 2010 17:12:02 GMT -9
Ya know 566b, I like a lot of what you have to say and the way you said it. I don't believe the box class has a computer that drives the car down the track and don't believe anyone else does either (even if we sound like we do). The real difference is when you let go off the red button. This determines completely separate classes. As most racers know the race is not always won at the stripe but the start line. If all things are equal and both cars run their respective numbers the start line is where the race is won and lost. I know. It's happened to me before. The box class is extremely competitive and fun to watch. Unlike some, to me a W is a win and a L is a loss. Doesn't much matter to me if its by .002 or .2 the results are the same. I always want the white slip from the lady under the tower. I like the challenge of leaving off the bottom yellow and screwing it up some times. I also like knowing that the car in the other lane has the same chance of leaving early or just poorly. Thanks for sharing your side ;D
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Post by White Lightning on Mar 1, 2010 17:17:43 GMT -9
I dont think its ignorant to say that his car is computer "controlled", yes a doorcar does have a lot less likely chance of winning because it has a 100 more variables in a run then a dragster does. One thing Wild Willy said in an interview after being asked why he drove an altered, he stated, "If I wanted to go strait and have it be point and shoot, i would have a dragster" Even though at the time, dragsters were still in the works, the advantage was known. One of the oldest sayings in dragracing is "combining man and machine", not "Man, Machine and electronics". To be honest, it sounds like we just have a bunch of grassroute drag racers who, if they had the chance, would run off of hand drops every other weekend. Im not saying its cheating, but it does give drivers a certain edge that most people with an honest eye and regular reflexes can't match with. What would be really nice is if we had Mod e.t extend to a 11.99 to 7.50 class or so, so the people who wanted to go faster then 8.50 and still be competitive could run those times without having a delay box. I know thats the one big reason my mom wants to stay in mod is because she wants to be competitive, but doesnt want a delay box, and dads a mechanic, hes not part of geek squad. Sorry if this comes across as "Snude" or "Mean" to anyone. Dang, that boy sounds like he knows what he's talking about sometimes.......wait!....Devin....did you copy tyhat out of one of your school books or somethin'
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Post by "Wild Child" on Mar 1, 2010 17:19:46 GMT -9
Are you sure it is Mike? I thought Mod ET was 8.50 - 11.99??? Can someone clarify??
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Post by "Wild Child" on Mar 1, 2010 17:20:59 GMT -9
ha... funny rob. Nope, those are my own words, spelling errors and all.
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